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Competitive Battling This board is for competitive battling discussion. Get team help or learn to play competitively.


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  #1  
Old 06-12-2009, 09:56 AM
Silvyre's Avatar
Silvyre Offline
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Default Rmt please. (ou)

My first competitive team ever put together, so don't shoot me if there's a glaringly obvious and/or stupid mistake. x3 There are two things of concern that I noticed and I would like some suggestions for.

One, this team would be in a rather tight fix against Ice-types. The only counters I have to that are Snorlax's Fire Blast and Togekiss's Aura Sphere (which obviously isn't much). The main thing I was concerned about with Togekiss was its speed; however, it can still survive Weavile's Ice Punch and OHKO with Aura Sphere, so that's nice.

Two, nearly every pokemon on this team has Leftovers as an item. >_> I'm not sure if that can and will work out fine, but it seems kind of off to me.

Anyways, here it is. Please and thanks for comments/suggestions. ^^


~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~



Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Hasty nature (+Spe, -Def)
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Ice Punch
- Counter
- Fake Out
- Night Slash

The lead, and I know it's one of the most common leads out there. I'm starting easy and (hopefully) working my way up. :P It's got a couple physical attacks because I'm also trying to get it to be somewhat of a physical attacker; that is, if it will last long enough.
Lucario, who totally counters this set, can be countered by Hippowdon, who can switch in and survive long enough to use Earthquake.


***



Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
- Moonlight
- Thunder Wave
- Ice Beam
- Charge Beam

A slight variation of the standard Support set from Smogon. It's my support, especially with T-Wave. The idea is to have the upperhand with Cresselia, cripple the opponent with T-Wave, and switch in to one of the other sweepers to do serious damage.
Ice Beam covers Salamence, some others of the kind like Dragonite, and possibly Garchomp. Charge Beam covers Water-types, namely Gyarados.


***



Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Calm nature (+SpD, -Atk)
252 HP / 6 Def / 252 SpD
- Nasty Plot
- Aura Sphere
- Air Slash
- Roost

I love Togekiss as a special sweeper. 8D This is the standard Nasty Plot Sweeper from Smogon, but I made a sort of twist to it. The idea is, because Cresselia already covers paralization (essentially, status ailments) with T-Wave (not to mention Hippowdon's Toxic), there's no need for Body Slam. And besides, I figured I need the Nasty Plot anyway, and it's impossible to have both.
She is generally brought in after the opponent is crippled, and proceeds to do serious damage. Air Slash is nice because they only have a 40% chance of attacking. Nasty Plot is used, generally while an opponent's crippled, to make sure the damage keeps going.


***



Swampert @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
252 HP / 6 Atk / 252 Def
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Avalanche
- Roar

Your basic Physical Swampert with a variety of moves, including Roar for switch-outs. I decided not to go with a water-type move because everything that water is offensively strong against, is covered by EQ - which multiple of my pokemon know - or Avalanche.
Stone Edge hits stronger Flying-types and covers Gyarados, if needed.


***



Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Sassy nature (+SpD, -Spe)
244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake

My special tank. His Fire Blast takes care of many Steel-types -- especially Lucario, with Earthquake as well -- even though he's primarily a physical attacker, because many Steel-types (ex. one of the more obvious: Steelix) have higher defenses than special defenses.


***



Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

My physical tank. It's essentially the standard Physical Wall set from Smogon, with Toxic as my filler.



Sprites from PE2K and Cresselia sprite from Bulbapedia

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  #2  
Old 06-12-2009, 10:27 AM
Viva la Gofre's Avatar
Viva la Gofre Offline
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Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvyre View Post
My first competitive team ever put together, so don't shoot me if there's a glaringly obvious and/or stupid mistake. x3 There are two things of concern that I noticed and I would like some suggestions for.

One, this team would be in a rather tight fix against Ice-types. The only counters I have to that are Snorlax's Fire Blast and Togekiss's Aura Sphere (which obviously isn't much). The main thing I was concerned about with Togekiss was its speed; however, it can still survive Weavile's Ice Punch and OHKO with Aura Sphere, so that's nice.

Two, nearly every pokemon on this team has Leftovers as an item. >_> I'm not sure if that can and will work out fine, but it seems kind of off to me.

Anyways, here it is. Please and thanks for comments/suggestions. ^^


~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~



Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Hasty nature (+Spe, -Def)
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Taunt
- Counter
- Fake Out
- Night Slash/Ice Punch

The lead, and I know it's one of the most common leads out there. I'm starting easy and (hopefully) working my way up. :P It's got a couple physical attacks because I'm also trying to get it to be somewhat of a physical attacker; that is, if it will last long enough.
Lucario, who totally counters this set, can be countered by Hippowdon, who can switch in and survive long enough to use Earthquake.

The only reason to use a dedicated anti-lead weavile over a sweeping weavile is because it can screw over opposing leads. Taunt is vital for that or the opponent with get their rocks up and weavile will not have achieved its main purpose.

***



Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
- Reflect
- Thunder Wave
- Ice Beam
- Charge Beam

A slight variation of the standard Support set from Smogon. It's my support, especially with T-Wave. The idea is to have the upperhand with Cresselia, cripple the opponent with T-Wave, and switch in to one of the other sweepers to do serious damage.
Ice Beam covers Salamence, some others of the kind like Dragonite, and possibly Garchomp. Charge Beam covers Water-types, namely Gyarados.

You do realise that your own hippowdon will halve the recovery rate of moonlight? Sandstorm drops it's recovery to a paltry 25%, which isn't worth using in a metagame filled with so many big hitters. Shove RestTalk in for recovery if you have to have it, or remove hippowdon.

***



Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Modestnature (+SpAtt, -Atk)
252SpAtt/152HP/104Spd
- Nasty Plot
- Aura Sphere
- Air Slash
- Roost

I love Togekiss as a special sweeper. 8D This is the standard Nasty Plot Sweeper from Smogon, but I made a sort of twist to it. The idea is, because Cresselia already covers paralization (essentially, status ailments) with T-Wave (not to mention Hippowdon's Toxic), there's no need for Body Slam. And besides, I figured I need the Nasty Plot anyway, and it's impossible to have both.
She is generally brought in after the opponent is crippled, and proceeds to do serious damage. Air Slash is nice because they only have a 40% chance of attacking. Nasty Plot is used, generally while an opponent's crippled, to make sure the damage keeps going.

Your togekiss is going to have great fun being a special sweeper when it has no EVs in any offensive stats. That's the standard spread for a sweeping togekiss, use it pleash.

***



Swampert @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
252 HP / 6 Atk / 252 Def
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Avalanche
- Roar

Your basic Physical Swampert with a variety of moves, including Roar for switch-outs. I decided not to go with a water-type move because everything that water is offensively strong against, is covered by EQ - which multiple of my pokemon know - or Avalanche.
Stone Edge hits stronger Flying-types and covers Gyarados, if needed.

Yep

***



Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Sassy nature (+SpD, -Spe)
244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Body Slam/Return
- Earthquake/Fire Blast

My special tank. His Fire Blast takes care of many Steel-types -- especially Lucario, with Earthquake as well -- even though he's primarily a physical attacker, because many Steel-types (ex. one of the more obvious: Steelix) have higher defenses than special defenses.

Snorlax reallly needs a STAB option to be offensively threatening, the two moves you have listed should be used over one another rather than together. Bare in mind that if steelix is your main motivation behind choosing fire blast, he hasn't been using in OU since the late 80s.

***



Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

My physical tank. It's essentially the standard Physical Wall set from Smogon, with Toxic as my filler.

Yep

Sprites from PE2K and Cresselia sprite from Bulbapedia

Comments in bold. I gotta go to an exam now so I'll edit in the overall rate when I get back this afternoon.
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  #3  
Old 06-12-2009, 02:16 PM
Ah Beng I the Pikabeng's Avatar
Ah Beng I the Pikabeng Offline
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Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvyre View Post

Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
- Moonlight
- Thunder Wave
- Ice Beam
- Charge Beam

A slight variation of the standard Support set from Smogon. It's my support, especially with T-Wave. The idea is to have the upperhand with Cresselia, cripple the opponent with T-Wave, and switch in to one of the other sweepers to do serious damage.
Ice Beam covers Salamence, some others of the kind like Dragonite, and possibly Garchomp. Charge Beam covers Water-types, namely Gyarados.
And since when was Charge Beam a good attack for taking down Pokemon in one hit (which really is essential in-game)? Thunderbolt is the typical move to take down this kind of stuff. :| And seeing that Cresselia can't use that move... give it to someone else.

Remove either this or Hippowdon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvyre View Post

Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Sassy nature (+SpD, -Spe)
244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake

My special tank. His Fire Blast takes care of many Steel-types -- especially Lucario, with Earthquake as well -- even though he's primarily a physical attacker, because many Steel-types (ex. one of the more obvious: Steelix) have higher defenses than special defenses.
Fire Punch works better than Fire Blast. And don't bother upping its Speed; its max is 174 = not worth it. Hence: 252 HP/252Atk/4Def with an Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpAtk), with the moves:
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Double-Edge/Last Resort
-Any good Physical move

No problem with Leftovers though.
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Last edited by Ah Beng I the Pikabeng; 06-12-2009 at 02:19 PM.
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  #4  
Old 06-12-2009, 02:54 PM
Volcanflame's Avatar
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Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

Charge Beam has a nifty 70% chance to raise Special Attack, which is always good.

And ... your comment on Snorlax convinces me that you're not really into competitive battling. Firstly, he said that he wants his Snorlax to be a special wall, and Sassy is definitely the best nature. Sassy = + Special Defense, and - Speed. Return is much better than Double Edge, IMO. And Body Slam's possibility to paralyse the foe is neat. Last Resort is ... meh :|

Oh, and Restalk Snorlax is ... fail these days. Thanks to his amazing 149 Defense, Infernape owns him hard.

-Volcan-
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  #5  
Old 06-12-2009, 03:05 PM
Viva la Gofre's Avatar
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Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

Ah beng, charge beam has always been a great move on cresselia. He has a good deal of staying power and can rack up boosts pretty quickly. As said above, he wanted his snorlax to be a special wall and you've made it something completely different and pretty ineffective. Fire blast is the better choice over fire punch despite the low stat, due to it's higher power and the fact steel types tend to have lower SpDef stats.
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  #6  
Old 06-12-2009, 06:56 PM
Silvyre's Avatar
Silvyre Offline
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Posts: 175
Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

I'm a she.. Dx

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofre View Post
Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Hasty nature (+Spe, -Def)
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Taunt
- Counter
- Fake Out
- Night Slash


The lead, and I know it's one of the most common leads out there. I'm starting easy and (hopefully) working my way up. :P It's got a couple physical attacks because I'm also trying to get it to be somewhat of a physical attacker; that is, if it will last long enough.
Lucario, who totally counters this set, can be countered by Hippowdon, who can switch in and survive long enough to use Earthquake.

The only reason to use a dedicated anti-lead weavile over a sweeping weavile is because it can screw over opposing leads. Taunt is vital for that or the opponent with get their rocks up and weavile will not have achieved its main purpose.


***

Snorlax @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Sassy nature (+SpD, -Spe)
244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Body Slam
- Fire Blast


My special tank. His Fire Blast takes care of many Steel-types -- especially Lucario, with Earthquake as well -- even though he's primarily a physical attacker, because many Steel-types (ex. one of the more obvious: Steelix) have higher defenses than special defenses.

Snorlax reallly needs a STAB option to be offensively threatening, the two moves you have listed should be used over one another rather than together. Bare in mind that if steelix is your main motivation behind choosing fire blast, he hasn't been using in OU since the late 80s.
Thanks, that's all been changed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofre View Post
Cresselia @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
- Rest
- Thunder Wave
- Sleep Talk
- Charge Beam


A slight variation of the standard Support set from Smogon. It's my support, especially with T-Wave. The idea is to have the upperhand with Cresselia, cripple the opponent with T-Wave, and switch in to one of the other sweepers to do serious damage.
Ice Beam covers Salamence, some others of the kind like Dragonite, and possibly Garchomp. Charge Beam covers Water-types, namely Gyarados.

You do realise that your own hippowdon will halve the recovery rate of moonlight? Sandstorm drops it's recovery to a paltry 25%, which isn't worth using in a metagame filled with so many big hitters. Shove RestTalk in for recovery if you have to have it, or remove hippowdon.
>_< Whoops, totally my bad. Fixed. One question: if Ice Beam has been taken out, Swampert's Avalanche will still cover most of those threats, right?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofre View Post
Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Modest nature (+SpAtt, -Atk)
252SpAtk/152HP/104Spd

- Nasty Plot
- Aura Sphere
- Air Slash
- Roost

I love Togekiss as a special sweeper. 8D This is the standard Nasty Plot Sweeper from Smogon, but I made a sort of twist to it. The idea is, because Cresselia already covers paralization (essentially, status ailments) with T-Wave (not to mention Hippowdon's Toxic), there's no need for Body Slam. And besides, I figured I need the Nasty Plot anyway, and it's impossible to have both.
She is generally brought in after the opponent is crippled, and proceeds to do serious damage. Air Slash is nice because they only have a 40% chance of attacking. Nasty Plot is used, generally while an opponent's crippled, to make sure the damage keeps going.

Your togekiss is going to have great fun being a special sweeper when it has no EVs in any offensive stats. That's the standard spread for a sweeping togekiss, use it pleash.
x__x Again, my bad, that one was huge. I guess I majorly overlooked her nature and EV spread.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ah Beng I the Pikabeng View Post
And since when was Charge Beam a good attack for taking down Pokemon in one hit (which really is essential in-game)? Thunderbolt is the typical move to take down this kind of stuff. :| And seeing that Cresselia can't use that move... give it to someone else.
...I'm a little confused by what you mean. Did you mean to say "really is essential in competitive battling"? xD And of course Cresselia can't learn Thunderbolt, but (as Volcan said) Charge Beam gets a nice boost pretty often.
I know Charge Beam is especially good for Gyarados, but I didn't mean that it was the only target for this move. Other Water-types are generally covered by Cresselia's Charge Beam.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ah Beng I the Pikabeng View Post
Fire Punch works better than Fire Blast. And don't bother upping its Speed; its max is 174 = not worth it. Hence: 252 HP/252Atk/4Def with an Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpAtk), with the moves:
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Double-Edge/Last Resort
-Any good Physical move
I agree with Volcan and Gofre. I know what you mean, but what I'm saying is that Steel-types generally have awesome physical defenses, as opposed to average special defenses. Though Fire Punch does seem to work better, Fire Blast has higher power and it's specially based, so it can take out things like Lucario and Steelix better.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ah Beng I the Pikabeng View Post
No problem with Leftovers though.
Great! I was assuming that having all mons with the same item would be a problem. x) But thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcanflame View Post
Oh, and Restalk Snorlax is ... fail these days. Thanks to his amazing 149 Defense, Infernape owns him hard.
Okay. I haven't edited anything on him yet, but what other options are you thinking of?


Thanks to all for the comments. ^^
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  #7  
Old 06-12-2009, 07:12 PM
Viva la Gofre's Avatar
Viva la Gofre Offline
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Posts: 1,540
Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

The restTalk snorlax Ah Beng was talking about was the aggressive type he listed, the walling variant still works fine. Besides, why would you be allowing physical attacks to hit your special wall? That was a stupid point he made. As for cresselia, use ice beam over one of the electric moves, preferably thunder wave. The paralysis is nice but it's just gonna leave ground types setting up on you, which is one of the things cresselia is meant to stop. Boltbeam offers nice coverage and can work alongside swampet by hitting pokes with inferior SpDef while swampy goes for anything with inferior Def stats.
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  #8  
Old 06-12-2009, 11:53 PM
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Default Re: Rmt please. (ou)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofre View Post
Besides, why would you be allowing physical attacks to hit your special wall? That was a stupid point he made.
Hm, yes, I was being stupid when I typed that I guess xP

-Volcan-
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