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  #16  
Old 04-26-2009, 12:27 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranma View Post
Well shouldn't they get all the same rights as us anyways? If they start asking for more than that, that's when we should start declining them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ah Beng I the Pikabeng View Post
What else can they ask for, anyway? If they want equal rights, give it to them. Only when they demand more than that, then we should decline them.
I dont mind the rights and their personal lives. They can do what they want together but I think marriage has always been a religious thing. Leave it like that. The benefits they can have though. I just wouldnt consider it marriage.

As for the asking for more thing. You can use the same thing you use for gay marriage. Say someone wants to get married to an animal. Its their life how will it affect you if their miles away? Etc...At that rate people will be doing whatever they want.
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  #17  
Old 04-26-2009, 01:53 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Starkipraggy View Post
This is where I step in and say: How much is too much?

Public display of homosexual love in public? Last I checked, not many people were for public display of heterosexual love in public either.
You don't need the "in public". >_>

Anyway. I guess it should be done in limited amounts, and when there are fewer people, such as at night. Both of them. Actually, this is already true for public display of heterosexual love...

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Originally Posted by spartan117 View Post
I dont mind the rights and their personal lives. They can do what they want together but I think marriage has always been a religious thing. Leave it like that. The benefits they can have though. I just wouldnt consider it marriage.

As for the asking for more thing. You can use the same thing you use for gay marriage. Say someone wants to get married to an animal. Its their life how will it affect you if their miles away? Etc...At that rate people will be doing whatever they want.
Really, we need to draw a line somewhere. And when we do that, it'd be fine.
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  #18  
Old 04-26-2009, 02:23 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Ranma View Post
Well shouldn't they get all the same rights as us anyways? If they start asking for more than that, that's when we should start declining them.
What the hell? Thats like saying to slaves "Sure, you can be free, but you can't get jobs, have children etc...". What do you base your assumptions on?
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  #19  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:04 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Madame Libra View Post
What the hell? Thats like saying to slaves "Sure, you can be free, but you can't get jobs, have children etc...". What do you base your assumptions on?
Right I agree with you, people are people and they should have the right to marry whoever, whatever the hell they want. Just my opinion, but I am straight, and would like to stay that way!
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  #20  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:10 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

Marriage isn't the issue. Things like Don't Ask, Don't Tell are.

That being said, the US has been notoriously bad at separate-but-equal, so I believe homosexual people should be allowed to marry.

@Libra: That wasn't his point at all. He was correcting spartan's implied assumption that homosexual couples would get more rights than straight couples.
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  #21  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:44 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

I also don't want to turn this into a religious debate but I want to say this:In the Bible it says it's wrong to be homosexual, but as I have read it, I never did come across it saying, it's ok for Christians no Humans to deny someone's rights(or FREE WILL) because of there sexually orientation. (If anyone has a verse saying a variation of that, please post it) I think everyone has the right to get married to who every they choose and denying someone that right is playing God. So I say let God handle this and not humans.

I would also like to add that I think being a homosexual is wrong. I know, it sounds like a paradox, but it's not. Shouldn't and can't are two different words.
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  #22  
Old 04-26-2009, 08:32 AM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

I'm not going to start posting my religious beliefs or whatever

All I can say is that if two people actually LOVE each other, then they have every right to be together, get married, and have a happy life.

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  #23  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:52 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage



A picture is worth a thousand words. (This one's worth 1,042 words, technically.)


As a bisexual who may well end up with another woman, I do think gay marriage should be different than straight marriage. I see it a lot like christmas and Hanukkah. They're both equal, but have different traditions. So, why should gays and lesbians use a straight marriage ceremony, when clearly the 'tradition' is different in both cases? Heck, give it a different name, let us have our own celebration. If marriage is the heteresexual celebration of the joining of a man and a woman who intend to become a family, make a new thing which is the joining of a woman and a woman, or a man and a man. Taa-daa. Everyone gets to 'marry' or whatever their equivalent is, and straight people don't ahve to worry about the sanctity of their marriage being encroached on.

Then again, I think we need to accept there ARE instances of separate but equal. Segregation is wrong- it's separating people racially, which is totally illogical. It's based on prejudice, not belief. On the other hand, people of different religions celebrate their religions separately, in groups of their own- and this is belief-based, and only happens in these parts of their lives, IE, we don't segregate by religion for where you ride the bus and such. And this is what separate but equal should mean- everyone gets to celebrate their own separate traditions however they like, and they should be treated equally no matter what their tradition is. (Provided it doesn't include child abuse or human sacrifice or whatnot.) Gay marriage is the same way- give everyone their own honestly equal tradition, none of this 'civil union' stuff, and the problem is solved.
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  #24  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:54 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

I expect this post to be fully skipped anyway lol.

Basically, no one should give a **** if someone's gay. Not make them miserable but not cheer them on for it. The only people who use gay in every sentence irl are schoolkids. (Most)
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  #25  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by FireflyK View Post


A picture is worth a thousand words. (This one's worth 1,042 words, technically.)


As a bisexual who may well end up with another woman, I do think gay marriage should be different than straight marriage. I see it a lot like christmas and Hanukkah. They're both equal, but have different traditions. So, why should gays and lesbians use a straight marriage ceremony, when clearly the 'tradition' is different in both cases? Heck, give it a different name, let us have our own celebration. If marriage is the heteresexual celebration of the joining of a man and a woman who intend to become a family, make a new thing which is the joining of a woman and a woman, or a man and a man. Taa-daa. Everyone gets to 'marry' or whatever their equivalent is, and straight people don't ahve to worry about the sanctity of their marriage being encroached on.

Then again, I think we need to accept there ARE instances of separate but equal. Segregation is wrong- it's separating people racially, which is totally illogical. It's based on prejudice, not belief. On the other hand, people of different religions celebrate their religions separately, in groups of their own- and this is belief-based, and only happens in these parts of their lives, IE, we don't segregate by religion for where you ride the bus and such. And this is what separate but equal should mean- everyone gets to celebrate their own separate traditions however they like, and they should be treated equally no matter what their tradition is. (Provided it doesn't include child abuse or human sacrifice or whatnot.) Gay marriage is the same way- give everyone their own honestly equal tradition, none of this 'civil union' stuff, and the problem is solved.

Yes, but the thing in, marriage has always been religious. A 'civil union' is the closest thing they can get to marriage without creating a whole new religion.

And it still alienates their religious beliefs. They want to get MARRIED, not civilly unionized, nor any othr type of celebration.
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  #26  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:04 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Cipher Lord View Post
Yes, but the thing in, marriage has always been religious. A 'civil union' is the closest thing they can get to marriage without creating a whole new religion.

And it still alienates their religious beliefs. They want to get MARRIED, not civilly unionized, nor any othr type of celebration.
The government doesn't regulate religion, just... marriage. The pen and paper aspect. And they should run that part non-religiously. Also, remember, Marriage is religious, but not always christian- there are many people of other more accepting religions, so one could indeed be married religiously even in a gay marriage.

Wanting to be married isn't a religious belief, it's a personal one, and I think the fight against civil unions is because they're seen as lesser to marriage. ON the other hand, creating an equal tradition to celebrate two women/two men would not be seen that way.

It's kind of, again, like a religion metaphor. In school, in the US, kids write to santa. Jewish kids are made to write to 'frosty the snowman', and no one likes that, 'cause he's not a religious figure, just a "Well, we'll try to include you" which makes everyone upset. No one wants to be stuck writing to a popular greeting-card image character just to make the teacher feel inclusive. On the other hand, if you sit the Christian kids down to write to santa and give the Jewish kids a dreidel, everyone's got their own equal tradition and everyone's happy.
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  #27  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:04 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

Even during slavery, African Americans were allowed to be married.

What does this say about how homophobic we really are?
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  #28  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:06 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Lonsie View Post
Even during slavery, African Americans were allowed to be married.

What does this say about how homophobic we really are?
Not all of them were allowed to marry though, and often times people let them marry so they would have more child slaves. =\
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  #29  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:14 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by FireflyK View Post
The government doesn't regulate religion, just... marriage. The pen and paper aspect. And they should run that part non-religiously. Also, remember, Marriage is religious, but not always christian- there are many people of other more accepting religions, so one could indeed be married religiously even in a gay marriage.

Wanting to be married isn't a religious belief, it's a personal one, and I think the fight against civil unions is because they're seen as lesser to marriage. ON the other hand, creating an equal tradition to celebrate two women/two men would not be seen that way.

It's kind of, again, like a religion metaphor. In school, in the US, kids write to santa. Jewish kids are made to write to 'frosty the snowman', and no one likes that, 'cause he's not a religious figure, just a "Well, we'll try to include you" which makes everyone upset. No one wants to be stuck writing to a popular greeting-card image character just to make the teacher feel inclusive. On the other hand, if you sit the Christian kids down to write to santa and give the Jewish kids a dreidel, everyone's got their own equal tradition and everyone's happy.
the Dreidel wasn't made to 'make it equal', the Dreidel, unlike Siant Nicholas, has a proper background. Saint Nicholas gave dowries to poor women to prevent them from becoming prostitutes.

And wasn't the 'civil union' supposed to be 'their marriage'. Wouldn't it be the same if they tried to make a 'seperate but equal' celebration for that. And it then all goes back to civil rights; why can't we just give them a marriage in the first place. Being gay doesn't make you any less of a person, and you said it yourself, it doesn't always have to be a religious thing.
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  #30  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:20 PM
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Default Re: Gay marriage

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Originally Posted by Cipher Lord View Post
the Dreidel wasn't made to 'make it equal', the Dreidel, unlike Siant Nicholas, has a proper background. Saint Nicholas gave dowries to poor women to prevent them from becoming prostitutes.
Precisely. So instead of trying to just base gay marriage traditions off straight ones for 'equality', find something traditional for those couples and make the ceremony around that.

Quote:
And wasn't the 'civil union' supposed to be 'their marriage'. Wouldn't it be the same if they tried to make a 'seperate but equal' celebration for that. And it then all goes back to civil rights; why can't we just give them a marriage in the first place. Being gay doesn't make you any less of a person, and you said it yourself, it doesn't always have to be a religious thing.
No. The civil union was an attempt to say "Here's your rights, now hush, we don't want public gay marriage." Civil unions were an attempt to push the gay community out of sight and shut them up with a ceremony that was called LESS than marriage. That's hardly equality.

It's not that I don't think gay people deserve marriage. Heck, since I may someday have a lesbian marriage, I'd never say that. I just don't think we need to have 'marriages' following straight traditions. I think we need our own tradition.
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