Member List
Calendar
F.A.Q.
Search
Log Out
Pokemon Forum - Pokemon Elite 2000  
 

Go Back   Pokemon Forum - Pokemon Elite 2000 » Other Boards » Discussion

Discussion This is for discussion about current events (news), issues, politics, and any other topics of serious discussion. For more casual talk, go to the Other Chat board. Proper sentences, spelling, and grammar is especially strict in this board.


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #31  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:32 AM
Lord Celebi's Avatar
Lord Celebi Offline
Zhu-Quiao
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,317
Send a message via AIM to Lord Celebi Send a message via Skype™ to Lord Celebi
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
if it was a real mother, she would sacrifice herself to save her baby. thats why we have adoption services.
A) I don't think you have any business defining the term 'Real Mother.'
B) Adoption services suck. If you grow up in an adoption center, you will have fewer job and educational opportunities. They're also underfunded and overcrowded because of the religious freaks who think abortion is bad.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:32 AM
Psychedelic Shroomish's Avatar
Psychedelic Shroomish Offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,207
Send a message via AIM to Psychedelic Shroomish
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
i think this is where your wrong.






i think this'll rebuttle your opinion Adrenaline. the fact that life begins WAY before that.
NOOO, THEY ARE ALL WRONG!! Adrenaline is never wrong...


Plz give further proof to support your case!!
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:42 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Celebi View Post
A) I don't think you have any business defining the term 'Real Mother.'
B) Adoption services suck. If you grow up in an adoption center, you will have fewer job and educational opportunities. They're also underfunded and overcrowded because of the religious freaks who think abortion is bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
NOOO, THEY ARE ALL WRONG!! Adrenaline is never wrong...


Plz give further proof to support your case!!
Quote:
One aspect of the legal abortion regime now in place has been determining when the fetus is "viable" outside the womb as a measure of when the "life" of the fetus is its own (and therefore subject to being protected by the state). In the majority opinion delivered by the court in Roe v. Wade, viability was defined as "potentially able to live outside the woman's womb, albeit with artificial aid. Viability is usually placed at about seven months (28 weeks) but may occur earlier, even at 24 weeks." When the court ruled in 1973, the then-current medical technology suggested that viability could occur as early as 24 weeks. Advances over the past three decades have allowed fetuses that are a few weeks less than 24 weeks old to survive outside the woman's womb. These scientific achievements, while life-saving for premature babies, have made the determination of being "viable" somewhat more complicated. As of 2006, the youngest child to survive a premature birth in the United States was a girl born at the Baptist Hospital of Miami at 21 weeks and 6 days' gestational age
straight from wikipedia. plus:

Quote:
A CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll in January 2003 asked about the legality of abortion by trimester, using the question, "Do you think abortion should generally be legal or generally illegal during each of the following stages of pregnancy?" [13] This same question was also asked by Gallup in March 2000 and July 1996.[14]

2003 Poll 2000 Poll 1996 Poll
Legal Illegal Legal Illegal Legal Illegal
First trimester 66% 29% 66% 31% 64% 30%
Second trimester 25% 68% 24% 69% 26% 65%
Third trimester 10% 84% 8% 86% 13% 82%
and:

Quote:
There were few laws on abortion in the United States at the time of independence, except the common law adopted from England, which held abortion to be legally acceptable if occurring before quickening. James Wilson, a framer of the U.S. Constitution, explained as follows:

“ With consistency, beautiful and undeviating, human life, from its commencement to its close, is protected by the common law. In the contemplation of law, life begins when the infant is first able to stir in the womb. By the law, life is protected not only from immediate destruction, but from every degree of actual violence, and, in some cases, from every degree of danger.”
Plus:

Quote:
Various anti-abortion statutes began to appear in the 1820s. In 1821, Connecticut passed a statute targeting apothecaries who sold poisons to women for purposes of abortion, and New York made post-quickening abortions a felony and pre-quickening abortions a misdemeanor eight years later. It is sometimes argued that the early American abortion statutes were motivated not by ethical concerns about abortion but by worry about the safety of the procedure, but some legal theorists believe that this theory is inconsistent with the fact that abortion was punishable regardless of whether any harm befell the pregnant woman and that many of the early statutes punished not only the doctors or abortionists, but also punished the women who hired them.[24] Many early feminists, including Susan B. Anthony and Elizabeth Cady Stanton, argued against abortion for a variety of reasons. The former wrote:

“ Guilty? Yes, no matter what the motive, love of ease, or a desire to save from suffering the unborn innocent, the woman is awfully guilty who commits the deed. It will burden her conscience in life, it will burden her soul in death; but oh! thrice guilty is he who, for selfish gratification, heedless of her prayers, indifferent to her fate, drove her to the desperation which impels her to the crime.”
evidence enough?
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:50 AM
Psychedelic Shroomish's Avatar
Psychedelic Shroomish Offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,207
Send a message via AIM to Psychedelic Shroomish
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
straight from wikipedia. plus:


/insertfalseinformationhere
I still don't believe it. I want more evidence.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:57 AM
Lord Celebi's Avatar
Lord Celebi Offline
Zhu-Quiao
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,317
Send a message via AIM to Lord Celebi Send a message via Skype™ to Lord Celebi
Default Re: When does life Begin?

All you did was give us a history of abortion... That proves nothing.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 11-14-2008, 02:59 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
I still don't believe it. I want more evidence.
why don't you still not believe me. or wikipedia. your just spamming up muh thread. plz don't

more? yousa gay or something. wikipedia is not wrong.

EDIT: the history gives reasons. just read it for deeper meaning.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 11-14-2008, 03:16 AM
Lord Celebi's Avatar
Lord Celebi Offline
Zhu-Quiao
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,317
Send a message via AIM to Lord Celebi Send a message via Skype™ to Lord Celebi
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
why don't you still not believe me. or wikipedia. your just spamming up muh thread. plz don't

more? yousa gay or something. wikipedia is not wrong.

EDIT: the history gives reasons. just read it for deeper meaning.
A) That personal attack was not called for, especially since Wikipedia's validity is always in question.
B) No, it doesn't. It shows a bunch of ignorant people made laws banning abortion. :/ Give your own reasons, not someone else's.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 11-14-2008, 03:23 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Celebi View Post
A) That personal attack was not called for, especially since Wikipedia's validity is always in question.
B) No, it doesn't. It shows a bunch of ignorant people made laws banning abortion. :/ Give your own reasons, not someone else's.
ok, i'll admit to that. fine, my own reasons. First of all, i believe that life starts at conception, but we've already gone over that. actually we've gone over my personal views. so technically ima just gonna sit here for a bit and either wait for a mod to lock this (plz don't) or for it to die (i pray it won't) until i can gather ALL of my evidence or find someone who posts and i can rebuttle it.

there is in fact a theory that abortion can/will cause breast cancer. In early pregnancy, levels of estrogen increase, leading to breast growth in preparation for lactation. The hypothesis proposes that if this process is interrupted by an abortion – before full maturity in the third trimester – then more relatively vulnerable immature cells could be left than there were prior to the pregnancy, resulting in a greater potential risk of breast cancer. The hypothesis mechanism was first proposed and explored in rat studies conducted in the 1980s.

give me a reason why it should be done. and when you think life starts.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 11-14-2008, 03:37 AM
Lord Celebi's Avatar
Lord Celebi Offline
Zhu-Quiao
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,317
Send a message via AIM to Lord Celebi Send a message via Skype™ to Lord Celebi
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
ok, i'll admit to that. fine, my own reasons. First of all, i believe that life starts at conception, but we've already gone over that. actually we've gone over my personal views. so technically ima just gonna sit here for a bit and either wait for a mod to lock this (plz don't) or for it to die (i pray it won't) until i can gather ALL of my evidence or find someone who posts and i can rebuttle it.

there is in fact a theory that abortion can/will cause breast cancer. In early pregnancy, levels of estrogen increase, leading to breast growth in preparation for lactation. The hypothesis proposes that if this process is interrupted by an abortion – before full maturity in the third trimester – then more relatively vulnerable immature cells could be left than there were prior to the pregnancy, resulting in a greater potential risk of breast cancer. The hypothesis mechanism was first proposed and explored in rat studies conducted in the 1980s.

give me a reason why it should be done. and when you think life starts.
I won't believe it until its a proven fact, which I will doubt, because its only Creationist Scientists who are researching it.

Why it should be done? So the mother and father don't have to ruin their lives to support a child they weren't ready for for 18 years.

Life starts when the fetus can think and move. Legal abortions are before the brain develops, so its not an issue. Flushing zygotes should be completely alright, since they're nothing more than a clump of cells.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 11-14-2008, 03:47 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Celebi View Post
I won't believe it until its a proven fact, which I will doubt, because its only Creationist Scientists who are researching it.

Why it should be done? So the mother and father don't have to ruin their lives to support a child they weren't ready for for 18 years.

Life starts when the fetus can think and move. Legal abortions are before the brain develops, so its not an issue. Flushing zygotes should be completely alright, since they're nothing more than a clump of cells.
a clump of cells? is that what we are? is a bunch of a cells? lets go abort you or something!
maybe those kids shouldn't be bed hopping. if they are 16 then they have problems. seriously. ok, if they are going to get knocked up together, they can deal with the concequences. ok, Abortions is seriously just a scapegoat kinda thing so ppl can go and sleep together and not worry bout pregnancies because they can go
Quote:
Flushing zygotes
because all they are is a
Quote:
clump of cells
so why worry? thats the problem in this Messed up country.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 11-14-2008, 03:57 AM
skiboydoggy's Avatar
skiboydoggy Offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Exploding Robots
Posts: 3,706
Send a message via AIM to skiboydoggy
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Nice. Argument Ad Hominem, Red Herrings, Sources with Validity in Doubt, Strawmen, and Appeals to Emotion.

Why not extend that argument to condoms and IUVs too? Or morning after pills?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 11-14-2008, 04:01 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboydoggy View Post
Nice. Argument Ad Hominem, Red Herrings, Sources with Validity in Doubt, Strawmen, and Appeals to Emotion. what?
Why not extend that argument to condoms and IUVs too? Or morning after pills?
why not? because thats not what this arguement is about.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 11-14-2008, 04:16 AM
skiboydoggy's Avatar
skiboydoggy Offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Exploding Robots
Posts: 3,706
Send a message via AIM to skiboydoggy
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
why not? because thats not what this arguement is about.
A) All of those are massive logical fallacies/generally bad debate techniques.

B) Why would it not apply? If life begins at conception, then the IUV and morning after pill would be just as cruel as abortion, even cheaper, and much less painful.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 11-14-2008, 04:23 AM
ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE Offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: HOOTERS.
Posts: 773
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboydoggy View Post
A) All of those are massive logical fallacies/generally bad debate techniques.

B) Why would it not apply? If life begins at conception, then the IUV and morning after pill would be just as cruel as abortion, even cheaper, and much less painful.
...good point. very good point indeed. but why throw in condoms?
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 11-14-2008, 04:37 AM
Surly Professor's Avatar
Surly Professor Offline
Monsterous
Elite Trainer (Level 2)
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Terra Incognita
Posts: 2,028
Default Re: When does life Begin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThEcHaMpIoNoFsApPhIrE View Post
why not? because thats not what this arguement is about.
You are so right.
I didn't even realize this was a joke thread. I totally fell for it dude.
Good one.
__________________

The good can decay many ways.
The good candy came anyways.

Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Style Design: AlienSector.com